Texas heading to the Big 10/11? Colorado to the 12-Pac?
by Redhawk on Feb 11, 2010 5:09 PM CST
37 comments
Well, it's no longer a rumor, or rather it's a rumor that now has hit the main stream press. The Lawrence Journal and World News (and International Airport) is reporting that Texas and the Big 10 have started preliminary talks for UT to join the Big 10. Think it's crazy? Well, a blogger named Frank the Tank, has been writing about the Big 10 expansion for awhile. He's actually the best I've read when it comes to league expansion, as he's a Chicago lawyer, that deals with mergers, and large transactions. He was the first one to put the bulls-eye on Texas, and it makes sense, in every way but geographically. Why would they go? They've got $10 million dollars a year reasons to make the switch!
While on the left coast the Pac-10 is talking expansion, as well This one is all about TV and the income that goes with it. The 2 most speculated to join the new 12-Pac is Utah, and Colorado, and giving the 12-Pac a foothold in 2 large TV markets in Salt Lake City and Denver/Front Range. I'm not sure what CU would gain as the Pac-10 is just as bad financially as the Big 12, but if UT bolts, then the 12-Pac looks better.
Who would join the Big 12 if they lost 2 teams? Speculations include BYU, Arkansas, LSU and New Mexico all 4 would bring TV's, though none really replaces UT. Another crazy suggestion I had read somewhere on the interwebs was Notre Dame. Hey....it's no crazier than UT to the Big 10.
It's also far easier said to throw out speculations, then it is to break contracts (in the case of Ark joining the Big 12) or to get legislative approval (in the case of UT leaving the big 12), or to get 11 unanimous votes (in the case of the Big 11 approving anyone to join their league)
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Not Gonna Happen With Texas But I Can See Colorado Doing It
Unlike the Big 12 the Big 10 would be a conference that Texas could win on a consistent basis.
you so need to read the Frank the Tank stuff. And when I say that you’ll want to set aside several hours. Texas would make about $10 million dollars a year more in the Big 10 then they currently do in the Big 12. However, the Pac 10 and the Big 12, at the moment are pretty close (which makes Colorado more doubtful)…..which is pretty crappy compared to the Big 10 and the SEC.
Don’t think like a fan, or even an Athletic Director, think like a University President trying to raise/make the most money that you can make.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
I read the Frank the Tank Stuff
And wow….The Whorn fans commenters to his blog post were condescending and arrogant towards A&M and OU, even by Whorn standards of arrogance.
But at least one fan was honest when he stated UT’s true intentions. UT is going to do what is best for UT. Period.
by HoustonSooner on Feb 12, 2010 12:02 PM CST up reply actions
luckly
UT can’t act totally alone. They have to go through the Texas Legislature, where there are other concerns than just how great UT is.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
Here's Why It Won't Happen
1) Texas doesn’t need the money. They boast constantly about having all the money in the world and in the end won’t be swayed by a Big 10 paycheck.
2) Texas doesn’t like playing games outside of the state of Texas. Last year they played 9 of their 12 regular season games in the Lone Star State. Losing Texas Tech, Texas A&M and Baylor from the schedule will make that no longer possible.
3) Texas recruits like playing games in the state of Texas. They’re not going to want to play games in Ohio, Pennsylvania and Illinois on a consistent basis. They want to play against their high school teammates at A&M, Tech, Baylor and Oklahoma in front of their family and friends. Texas makes this move and recruiting takes a hit.
4)Texas thinks they are God’s gift to the Big 12. Despite what reality actually tells us the Longhorns think that they are the best in the conference in everything. Like the other 11 schools they’ve been with the Big 12 since its inception and are one of the marquee programs in the conference (They’ll tell you that they are the marquee program) but that changes in the Big 10. At best they’d be fourth wheel behind Ohio State, Michigan and Penn State. That’s a blow to the Longhorn ego that they’re not willing to take and thus the reason why they’ll not be leaving the Big 12 for the Pac 10.
1) no they don’t, but when Indiana makes 22 million, and UT makes 12, there is a reason there.
2) actually I think this is an issue, and one I and others have not properly weighed. Not the road games but UT likes being king of the state of Texas. By not playing other Texas schools, they really won’t know that.
3) I think is tied to 2
4) I agree, they do think they are God’s Gift, but I see this as a reason to leave. They are tired of associating and playing the rift raft and low-lifes that is the rest of the Big 12, and they see the Big 10 as more upscale old money country club. (I think UT is one of the premier programs in the Big 12. OU, Neb, KU and UT to me are “stars” of the conference. Loosing UT would hurt the reputation of the Big 12)
I don’t think it happens either…..but because I don’t think it gets through the Texas legislature. Too many would have interest in making sure that Tech, A&M, Baylor would not be hurt when UT leaves. I think the Big 10 takes either Notre Dame or Rutgers.
CU….I’m thinking more and more WILL leave. I personally think it’s a lateral move in every way but one: Culturally. CU would rather smoke pot and think they are better then everyone else, and they truly don’t get the emphasis and love of sports, especially football, that the rest of the Big 12 has.
and if CU leaves…I so want Arkansas. I think that would actually make the Big 12 a BETTER conference.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
I would think that...
The land thieves would be relieved. Particularly is the RRS was ended – no more having to face the monsters from Austin.
You think Texas thinks they are God’s gift to the conference? OK, lets put it to the test – of all the teams that could leave the Big 12, which teams loss would hurt the conference more – ou (yawn) or Texas?
Furthermore, do you think a recruit would rather play in the resulting watered down Big 12 or play in a Big 10 – where every game is basically nationally televised? And, whether you admit it or not, the addition of Texas to the Big 10 would enhance EVEN MORE the desirability of national televised games.
You are right about one thing though – it’s all about money – you think ou wouldn;t jump to the Big 10 in a heartbeat? It’s not gonna happen though becausee what is the appeal of Norman? Big television base there, right? Texas bring in the whole state of Texas and all of the major cities thereof – but in OK? – Tulsa, Norman, Oklahoma City, ad nauseaum.
You see? It’s just business!
"Stats are for losers - I like winning games!!" Will Muschamp
by littlelonghorngirl on Feb 13, 2010 9:23 PM CST up reply actions
Yeah, We'd Really Miss Those Three Conference Championships You Guys Have Won
But thanks for proving me right about the typical Texas perspective towards the Big 12. Only Big 10 games are nationally televised, huh (And that’s only if Texas joins)? Bunch of talk about nothing because it isn’t going to happen.
It matters not..
if it offends your sensitivities about “perceived” arrogance of UT. Why is it then, when the Pac 10 or Big 10 talks of expansion, it is Texas they would like to reel in? I don’t hear any talk about ou – not in the least. The facts speak for themselves.
I will admit that I could not resist digging you ou supporters a little, and I suspect you are right. Texas will probably not leave the conference – but stranger things have happened.
"Stats are for losers - I like winning games!!" Will Muschamp
by littlelonghorngirl on Feb 15, 2010 9:33 AM CST up reply actions
As much as I hate Texas, they are clearly the marquee program in the conference.
One can argue about it not being justified by actual performance, but as a basketball/football/non-revenue sport force they are probably unmatched with the exception of Ohio State.
I think their departure would be as close to a death blow as the conference could take. The Big 12 has already been run into the ground by Bebee/Weiberg and their incredible incompetence, losing their most important member would leave us with an oversized Big 8.
Despite losing their sole reason for existence, I bet A&M would be ecstatic about this move. This would actually make them a power for the first time in their history…
by SoonerDutch on Feb 15, 2010 11:41 PM CST up reply actions
Furthermore
There is no way that UT would drop the RRS or the Aggie game – if money is the criteria for UT leaving then what is the logic in dropping two of the biggest revenue generating games the Longhorns have?
The legislature isn’t gonna allow it anyway and Mack Brown would really “love” having to post up on the Ohio’s, Michigans, Wisconsins and Michgan States instead of Baylor, Missouri and Colorado – oh yeah!
P.S. – Thank you for an honest appraisal – I will quit being such a smart ass. :-)
"Stats are for losers - I like winning games!!" Will Muschamp
by littlelonghorngirl on Feb 16, 2010 4:22 PM CST up reply actions
Big 10 Is Not A Better Conference
Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin and Michigan State < Oklahoma, Nebraska, Texas A&M and Missouri
Baylor, Missouri and Colorado = Indiana, Illinois and Minnesota
The Big 12 is also stronger in the middle. Yes, Texas was left off intentionally because they are the ones talking about leaving. As I stated earlier, its a conference that the Longhorns could win consistently (unlike the Big 12) which is a positive but let me tell you another reason why Texas won’t leave the Big 12. Where do you think they would play the conference championship game? Not in the state of Texas or neighboring states for sure.
In football this all may be true,
Although it’s debatable. I’d say performance wise, in football, the Big 12, sans Texas, is still a better conference. But the Big 10 is a much, much better league than the Big 12, sans Texas, market, reputation, leadership, and influence wise.
by SoonerDutch on Feb 16, 2010 5:24 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
I agree w/ CC which is vary rare...
I think Texas would not be interested in the road game travel, which would be brutal on the team. I also just don’t think the Texas Legislature is going to want to deal with this issue along with redistricting and the need to fix transportation funding during the 82 Leg. Additionally, Texas would most likely want to keep the rivalry games in place, which would make one hell of out-of-conference schedule. Seems like there are too many negatives for Texas to make the switch. However, this does give Texas leverage to get more $ from the Big 12.
Its an easier road to a championship through the Big 12 than it is having to deal with the Big 10 teams and the rivalry games.
ATX
For what it's worth
My take:
The Big 10 has first pick. Their money is overwhelming. Any school would want a cut of that pie. However, I don’t think it’s Texas, cause I don’t think that would get past the legislature where UT’s conference fate is decided. There would be too many A&M and Tech, and Baylor people in the Texas Legislature that would keep UT in the Big 12. I give UT a 25% chance, only because of the money fit, and academic angle.
So who joins the Big 10? either Notre Dame, or Rutgers, or maybe Syracuse, all of which help the Big 10. Missouri does add a good TV market, but not as much as does Notre Dame or Rutgers. So I don’t think the Big 12 loses a school to the Big 10. I’d give Missouri a 20% shot.
And if they don’t, there is little reason for Colorado to join the Pac 10. Yes, there are more American Association of University members in the Pac 10 then the Big 12, and that would be the only reason to leave, as the money from athletics would be pretty close. I’d give CU a 40% chance of leaving.
….that leaves the 12-Pac raiding the Mtn. West and/or WAC. But if Boise St joins the MWC the MWC would be almost guaranteed a BCS auto qualifier slot. However, expansion for the TV contracts would actually come a year before the next BCS auto qualification determination and Utah, might want the safe bird in the hand spot.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
I concur
Your argument makes the most sense
"Stats are for losers - I like winning games!!" Will Muschamp
by littlelonghorngirl on Feb 15, 2010 9:51 PM CST up reply actions
hmm
reading that article and blog post im intrigued as to where the RRS would go, would it be honestly worth it after that? should the big 12 keep its auto bid to the bcs, i dont see how that game could hold any relevancy as OU would have an easier way to get to a bigger bowl game without having to worry about a potential loss to UT
The OU-texass game
would just go on as a non-conference game as it has for 90 plus years. This game defines both OU and UT. It’s a unique game on a neutral site between 2 super-powers.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
Sorry...Don't agree
If UT-Austin divorces its 11 brothers and sisters, they are essentially throwing the RRS out the window. If you’re Mackie and Dodds, do you want an OOC slate that consists of OU and A&M every year along with Michigan, Penn State, Wisconsin, Ohio State every year? That schedule makes the 2008 schedule seem like powderpuff football, and a more difficult route to National Championships than their current route.
As I’ve stated on previous boards and have been ridiculed, the RRS means a lot more to OU than UT-Austin. It’s true. UT-Austin would sacrifice that tradition in a heartbeat for a few extra dollars.
I’m not saying UT will bolt to the Big X, but UT-Austin over the past few years feels that it is bigger than the conference. Hence the insistence on their own statewide TV network to the detriment of the conference.
by HoustonSooner on Feb 12, 2010 11:03 AM CST up reply actions
Sorry man
As I’ve stated on previous boards and have been ridiculed, the RRS means a lot more to OU than UT-Austin. It’s true. UT-Austin would sacrifice that tradition in a heartbeat for a few extra dollars.
But if you’ve been ridiculed, this is why. This is a completely baseless assertion without any supporting argument, and despite not having anything to back this up, you keep throwing it out there. I can sit here as a Texas alum and tell you that a) Oklahoma is our main rival and b) The game is very important to Texas. Is it “more” important to Oklahoma? I don’t know, and it’s beside the point. The RRS has been going on for forever, and unless it was some sort of serious financial detriment (which it’s not), Texas would not drop the game.
Furthermore:
Michigan, Penn State, Wisconsin, Ohio State every year?
Assuming, of course, all programs are as strong every year as they are reputed to be. Which they surely weren’t this past year. College football in general was down last year, so it’s hard to make too much of a case for the Big 10 over the Big 12 in football.
by TheElusiveShadow on Feb 13, 2010 1:52 PM CST up reply actions
Dude
Seriously? You are so ass backwards, it’s making you lose respect that you deserve. OU is the Horns biggest rival, and UT and OU both benefit from having a huge, national, competitive rivalry. Texas is not going to drop the RRS for “a few extra dollars”. Please stop writing ridiculously false statements that get you ridiculed. You have not the slightest morsel of evidence to back your claim, and are really making a fool out of yourself. I am beginning to feel sorry for you.
Way to make an arguement.
How can you back the fact that OU is Texas biggest rival?
How do you know they wouldn’t drop the RRS for a few extra dollars?
Please explain…..
" Answers -- Become Resources."
Without Questions; There are limited Resources...
There is no empirial proof
which is why I question how he knows that the RRS means more to Oklahoma then it does to UT. Did you go out and sample 50,000 Texas fans and ask them to give you a percentage of how important the OU game is in terms of the entire football season? And then do the same with OU fans? Has he talked with the Texas administration and athletic department and been able to gather that they just want to get “a few extra dollars” and would be happily willing to drop the RRS?
This dude is spewing garbage from his keyboard. If you never went to Texas, and just happened to hang around on campus for fall semester during football season, you would be able to tell that the entire campus gets way more pumped up for the OU game in Dallas then the aggy game – home or away. It isn’t something I have to prove to you, I can just tell you that being a student for 3 1/2 years on campus, Texas biggest rival is OU.
Here is another little fun fact:
Texas and OU used to be in different conferences!! Whoa! That means for most of their rivalry, they have been playing as non-conference opponents!! No way!
Seems like they would have no qualms moving it back to a non-conference game.
Buffs wanna go...
Check out our poll…
http://www.ralphiereport.com/2010/2/9/1302800/possible-move-to-the-pac-10
The Ralphie Report - University of Colorado Athletics
2000 votes? Holy cow
that’s actually enough votes to get a sampling. I don’t see how this will help CU out as the Pac-10 makes less money than the Big 12, but the 2 are close. With 2 additional schools and a championship football game, and a cable TV network, the 12-Pac should pass the Big 12. (who I suspect along with the SEC will join the Big 10, the Mtn West Con. and 12-Pac in forming their own cable channel)
The false advantage will be academically. CU is an American Association of University member. And the Pac 10 has less members in this elite group (UCLA, USC, Stanford, Oregon, Washington, Arizona) than does the Big 12 (CU, KU, Iowa St, Neb, UT, A&M, MIzzou) 6-7. Though I guess it could be argued that if UT or Mizzou go to the Big 10, it would be 6-6, and if CU joined the Pac 12, it would be 5-7.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
I think the big difference in the Pac-10
is the large number of research institutions in the conference compared to the Big 12.
The Ralphie Report - University of Colorado Athletics
that's what the AAU is
the elite of those research institutions. Really as a whole, the Big 12 schools aren’t that bad, and I’m not sure where the negative rap comes from. Again, the Big 12 has 7 AAU schools out of 12. The Big 10 has 11 out of 11, making it the best conference academically, even arguably better than the Ivy League. But if it’s academics that is the deciding factor, the Big 12 right now actually wins over the Pac 10
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
I'm way late to this party
(just looking at the preview for the b-ball game tonight and saw this) but to say the Big 12 is better academically than the Pac 10 is absurd. Basing your opinion solely on AAU membership is extremely short-sided. The Big 10 is better academically than the Ivy League?!? (and you forgot Cal, so that’s 7/10 versus 7/12 anyway…) The bottom of the Pac 10 and the middle/bottom of the Big 12 are about the same but the Pac 10 has 4 ivy-league-top-20-worldwide caliber schools, the Big 12 has none (the Pac 10’s top schools beat anyone in the Big 10 as well).
Honestly though, I don’t care about any of that at all! The thing is that CU sucks at pretty much every sport right now and our administration doesn’t care. Most CU fans feel that if we move to the 12-Pac we would get a fresh start athletically, get to travel to much better locations for road games (no offense anyone), and fit in better culturally and academically. If CU can make it work financially (huge issue, we’re broke as a joke) I bet we head out west. I don’t think Texas is going anywhere though…
Don't understand the connection
between athletic and academic prowess and why a school has to be a good academic fit to compete athletically in a conference and sustain a high level of success. I’m not understanding how AAU membership status has anything to do with athletic conference unity or the financial strength of the athletic departments of conference members.
We’re not talking the Ivy League here, and I’m sorry, there is no comparison between the Big X and the Ivies.
Please explain, because I’m not seeing the connection.
I don’t recall intense Big XII rivalries in academic competitions.
hey I'm with you on this one
but there is a sense of pride and accomplishment when it comes to academic excellence. That association of Universities we see in Athletic groupings, some how is viewed on the Academic side as well, I guess. Or they are trying to sell the athletic side to the academic side……but it’s an ATHLETIC conference..so, I too, think it’s a stretch to join the two together.
"You have been banned from the Purple Row, for Inappropriate conduct, profanity, (&) telling site authors their articles are crap."
Because membership in the Big 10 means membership
in the CIC, which has resources allocated to member instituions.
by SoonerDutch on Feb 17, 2010 7:39 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
If Texas leaves
we should beg them to take us with them.
by SoonerDutch on Feb 16, 2010 8:36 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Why not just make a...
SUPERCONFERENCE!!!!!!!!!
Take Florida, Alabama, Oklahoma, Texas, Ohio St., Penn St., USC, Nebraska, Boise St., Virginia Tech, Miami (FL), and a few other power teams. Play a round robin with the top two teams playing for the National Championship.
YAY SUPERCONFERENCE!!!!!!!
Boomer Sooner!
Come check out FanIQ for your one stop spot for all sports
by Jubanator14 on Feb 16, 2010 10:25 PM CST up reply actions
Exactly, I couldn't have said it better myself.
by SoonerDutch on Feb 17, 2010 12:55 PM CST up reply actions
I actually remember reading this last year
About the Super Conference idea but this one expanded to redoing all of College Football. Really interesting and almost makes too much sense.
http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/sports_college/2008/06/the-case-for-th.html
Boomer Sooner!
Come check out FanIQ for your one stop spot for all sports
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